Hi Spring fans! In this extra-long installment I talk with longtime friends and fellow developer advocates, Okta's Matt Raible and Google's James Ward. We talked about Java, Kotlin, Spring, cloud computing technologies, security, Go, paradigm changes, web frameworks past and present, Macromedia, Adobe, Scala, and a million more things! This was a ton of fun for me so I'm hoping you'll enjoy it too.

Google Developer Advocate James Ward on Twitter (@_jamesward) Okta Developer Advocate Matt Raible on Twitter (@mraible)